blackmattersus.com
Hello Depelsha! Could you please give us a brief background of what led you to create your group?
Depelsha Thomas McGruder
Sure. Well, just after seeing so many instances of Black men and boys being killed by law enforcement with a particular focus on the law enforcement cases because those are the people who have sworn to protect and serve us – I was very disturbed. I think it was Wednesday night, July 6, and when I went to bed I was watching the video that was being played over and over again on the news of Alton Sterling’s murder in Baton Rouge. When I woke up the next morning, there was a family in Minnesota on the news, and I was very confused because I couldn’t figure out who they were. I was trying to remember if there was a case in Minnesota that I had forgotten about or if they were related to Alton Sterling or how this fit into the narrative. Once I realized that it was actually another Black man who had been murdered by police in a different state since I went to bed the night before, it was just paralyzing. I felt a weight on me, hopeless, and I had trouble getting out of bed because I was so saddened by it. I went downstairs eventually because I had to cook breakfast for my children, and while I was cooking, I decided to activate an idea that I had had for a long time but had not done. Literally, the eggs were still scrambling on the stove; I walked to my computer and typed “MOBB – Mothers of Black Boys” because that was the name that had been in my mind. I invited about 30 of my friends to the group. Since I don’t really start Facebook groups, I didn’t really know how they worked, so I didn’t know people could add other people without me actually approving. I looked up and 5 minutes later, 30 people had grown to 150 mums who had been added, and then it took off from there. It went to 500 in an hour and a 1000, then 2000. I checked a few hours later from the grocery store, and it was 4000, then it grew to 21,000 by that same night and it has been growing exponentially since. As of today, we’re at more than 128,000 mums, so I think it just speaks to the need that is there and this fear that we all have about our sons. I specifically did it because I was just really sad and frustrated and I needed to connect with other mums who could understand. I have a Facebook page and I’m pretty vocal, but when you are in a mixed company you can’t really express things the same way because people have so many different points of view. But I knew that mums that were raising Black boys could understand what I was feeling at that moment, and I just needed to connect with other people.
blackmattersus.com
Did you expect that a little group of concerned mothers would grow into such a big community?
Depelsha Thomas McGruder
No, not at all. I was shocked. The first weekend I was overwhelmed by it like, “What have I done?” Because immediately, people started reaching out to me and saying, “How can I get involved in this? I want to start a chapter in my state, I want to buy the T-shirt.” They thought we were an organization. But it was just me and my kitchen! It was such an urgent need and we set up a conference call for that Saturday morning. 2 days later, I was on a conference call with about 50 mums from all over the country talking about what we can do. Now, the calls have more than doubled each week in terms of the number of mums participating. People have had enough, and they want to do something about this. We’re beyond just hashtagging and marching. People are ready to get involved in a more active and sustainable way to see what we can do as mums to solve this problem.
blackmattersus.com
So are you planning to do some sort of meetup in the city or some sort of protest or action?
Depelsha Thomas McGruder
We actually met in Philly, around the DNC. I wouldn’t call it a protest, because we were not protesting the DNC. But we wanted to have our presence known and our voice heard, so we just had a peaceful walk wearing T-shirts to just spread our message that unjustified violence and the killing of Black men and boys by those who are supposed to be protecting and serving us has to stop. I also want to say that I don’t think all law enforcement is bad. I think we have to solve this problem for them too because all the good police officers who go to work every day, put their lives on the line for us and do a good job, they’re being made to look bad by these people who are using excessive force and not acting within the bounds of what their job is supposed to be. I feel that we’re doing this just as much for them as we are for our children because they’re somebody’s son or daughter too.
blackmattersus.com
So aside the fact that recent events led you to create this group, what’s your vison for this page now? Is it a place where you think people could share their worries or where they could do some social change?
Depelsha Thomas McGruder
Absolutely. I think it’s two-fold. For some people, the group will continue to just be a support group because I think that’s needed. Some people only want to engage on that level. So without me guiding the conversation at all, people spontaneously started sharing photos of their sons and talking about all of their many accomplishments, and saying, “My son’s life matters.” It was very validating. I’ve gotten a lot of notes about people just feeling good about being there and having a community and it’s been especially interesting to see how many non-Black mothers are doing this. There are quite a few white mothers who are raising biracial children who just don’t even understand this whole conversation about race. They didn’t grow up having had it. If you’re a Black person in America, you know practically from the time you’re born that at some point you are going to have this conversation with your children about how to interact with the police and how they’re going to be treated differently, but if you are a white mum who didn’t grow up with that baggage, you don’t know what’s going on. So we’re having some really interesting conversations around race in that regard. That’s one part, but there’s a pretty sizeable contingent who want to mobilize into action, so we’re now in full strategy mode. We’ve broken up into committees; we’re looking for state captains to activate on the local, state and federal levels. We believe it has to be attacked from all levels to have sustainable change because the laws are different in different states and jurisdictions so you can’t just take a blanket approach, but I’d say in terms of our approach, we want to influence policy around this issue and change the perception of Black men and boys in the media and with law enforcement. We want to show our power politically and economically, so that means voting for people who support our cause and putting our dollars with companies and entities that support our cause and taking them away from those who don’t.
blackmattersus.com
So what are the main things that these mothers want you to do as a group?
Depelsha Thomas McGruder
I think the main focus is not really about us. It’s about our sons. But, I think we also have to invest in ourselves a bit because it’s very stressful being a mum of Black boys so we’re having a lot of conversations just around the mental health issues of that and the stress that we carry. We’re talking about how we can connect and support each other more, but it really is about action. The mothers are not sitting around just wanting to mope and lament. They want to mobilize into action. That’s the number one response I’m getting and the number one agenda topic we get on the calls. It’s not about just venting; it’s about how we solve this problem. And we believe that as mothers we are the best people to do this because we care the most. One thing that I’ve gotten a lot of questions on is: Can other people join the group? I’ve been very firm in saying that we don’t want men and people who aren’t mothers of Black sons in the group because I believe that you have to have the sustainability for this to work. Other people will come in and out and have different causes – this week it’ll be Black boys, next week it will be animals, but this will always be our cause for the rest of our lives. We don’t have a choice. We are the most invested in our sons’ survival, so we want to solve the problem and I think we can.
blackmattersus.com
Do you think the level of police violence has gone up in recent years?
Depelsha Thomas McGruder
That’s hard to say. I don’t know if the violence has gone up, I think we’re just seeing it more because of social media and because of everyone having a camera phone. And I always say that these are just the cases we’re seeing, cases like Eric Garner, Alton Sterling, Philando Castile and Tamir Rice. So think about all the people who didn’t have a camera, who weren’t brave enough to turn on their camera in that moment or maybe the police took their camera. We don’t know what’s happening in most situations so I actually don’t think the violence has gone up; I think we’re just seeing it more because of people having access to phones and social media.
blackmattersus.com
Does this problem concern everyone or mostly Black people?
Depelsha Thomas McGruder
I think that Black males are the number one target. Another question I’ve gotten a lot is, “What about girls? Girls are at risk too. What about Latinos?” I think those are valid, but I think Black males are the number one target and that’s what we see over and over again in the news. My belief is that if we can solve this problem for them, everybody else will benefit, so it’s not that I don’t care about other groups and that I don’t think other people are experiencing it, but I do think Black males are experiencing it more than anybody else. If we can, on a policy and perception level, do something that makes it better for them, everyone will benefit.
blackmattersus.com
You said in an interview that you don’t talk about police brutality with your children. How do you think a mother should explain such an issue to a child?
Depelsha Thomas McGruder
Well, I don’t know. The reason that I don’t is that my children are very young.They’re 7 and 4, and I don’t think they should have the burden of thinking about police brutality at that age. Yet, because there’s so much in the news, it’s seeping in. My 4 year old who’s very inquisitive and verbal, one night when they were going to bed and they were playing some kind of cops game where they’re pretending to put each other in jail, I was like, “No, we don’t play that. We don’t play putting in jail.” And he was like, “Mum, it’s just pretending. It’s not the real police who kill.” So his perception of police is that they kill, and that’s problematic for me because he deserves to have innocence as a child. He’s now made several comments asking about why the police have guns and how that just means they’re going to kill people. I don’t want my kids to even have to think about that at that age. They should just be having fun, enjoying and exploring life and figuring out who they are. I don’t know in terms of what mothers should say. I’m a Black woman from the South so historically you always know what you have to say, “Be respectful, obey and comply, and when a police officer pulls you over, do whatever he says.” But even when people do that, it’s not working. As far as we can tell, Philando Castile did that in Minnesota. He disclosed he had a weapon, he said he was getting his license and registration and that wasn’t enough. The man in Miami who was helping his autistic patient, he said, “He’s autistic, he has a toy truck, I’m a mental health professional.” And he still got shot. So I don’t know what to tell them. That’s why I feel like we have to do more than tell them. I don’t want to tell them anything. I want to tell the police at this point because I shouldn’t have to teach my children how to work around not being killed by the police. That’s not a reasonable expectation for a parent. I want them to look up to law enforcement. When I was growing up, police officers were considered heroes in the community and I think that we need to get back to that. But with the images we’re seeing, it’s not always easy to get there.
blackmattersus.com
So do you think it’s important for a child to know about racism as a topic or is it better to avoid talking about it at all?
Depelsha Thomas McGruder
I don’t think you can avoid it. I’m trying to delay it as long as I can but I think if you live in America, you’re going to have to talk about it at some point because it’s not just law enforcement. Long before a Black child has an experience with a police officer, they experience this in school, especially Black males. They’re treated differently. They’re assumed to be not as smart, troublemakers, they’re punished for infractions in school that other children aren’t, they are put in detention and into Special Ed more often. As a parent of a Black child you know that you have to be on top of this from day one, so you end up having the conversation, but personally, I’m trying to shield my children from it for as long as I can.
blackmattersus.com
Going through the MOBB group, how do you feel people are reacting to what’s happening at the moment. Are they concerned, frightened, or do they feel like nothing can be done about it?
Depelsha Thomas McGruder
I think they’re very concerned and frightened for their children, our children. And I do think they believe that something can be done because the amount of time we’ve spent on this since coming together and the amount of time people are investing, having conversations and generating ideas, I don’t think they would do that if they didn’t believe we could make a difference. We’re absolutely optimistic that in combination with other organizations we can make a difference and it can be solved.
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